Numbers at worlds?

[stirups99]

Hey All,

Anyone know what the ball speed and clubhead speed numbers were looking like at the worlds?

Thanks,

Greg

I can remember one guy  saying the top eight were hitting around 200 ball speed and up to 150 club speed.  In the past JZ has been known to reach over 160.  On the 24th of Dec we will hear  more when the worlds will be on espn

[Sodzilla]

I don't know whether they had anyone measuring the speeds this year -- I don't recall seeing anything like that displayed on the screen while the competitors were hitting.  

I did talk to Gerry James as he was warming up Saturday evening and he was using the Beltronics SwingMate.  It read 142 mph on both swings I watched, and based on the way he was hitting, his ball speed was most likely over 200 mph.

[stirups99]

Thanks for the reply's.

Not too sure, but... I'm thinking that if the top eight were swinging 150 mph clubhead speed, their ball speed would be above the 200 mark.

I.e. 150 * 1.34 = 200 ball speed

I'm thinking two things:

1. they weren't all swinging 150 mph
2. Their smash factor would be higher than 1.34

Thoughts anyone?

Greg

[Beowulf]

Thanks for the reply's.

Not too sure, but... I'm thinking that if the top eight were swinging 150 mph clubhead speed, their ball speed would be above the 200 mark.

I.e. 150 * 1.34 = 200 ball speed

I'm thinking two things:

1. they weren't all swinging 150 mph
2. Their smash factor would be higher than 1.34

Thoughts anyone?

Greg

205 MPH ballspeed was what Jason was posting all week long (consistently) on the titliest launch monitor.

I'd imagine all the people in the finals were at or above 200.  But, what sets Jason apoart are his optimal launch and spin.  He was actually hitting it quite a bit lower than most people at the world's this year (except for me, I couldn't get it over the horizon!!!!   :evil:   ).

Shawn

[TheDoctor]

Let me make this very clear.  You hit the nail on the head that if they were actually swinging 160mph then the ball speed numbers would be higher then 200's.  The answer to that quandry is that they absolutely were not swinging 160.  Not one of them.  People tend to toss that number around from time to time.  I will go on record as saying that even the biggest swingers in the game, mike dobbyn, mike moulton, brooks baldwin, clayton burger, carl wolter, dave gurekis, jason zuback, and any other huge swinger that I have failed to mention do not swing 160, ever.  This is not to say that these people are not hugely talented, because they are.  This is to say that we need to adjust our thinking from fantasy to reality.  In the game today 210 ball speed is the benchmark.  Anything higher then that is very rare to see, and nothing much higher then that exists.  The list of people who actually swing 150 is VERY short.  A neighbor of mine who has been a longdrive staple for a very long time would argrue that the list of people who swing over 150 is non-existent.  Regardless of all of that a well struck 140mph swing is all you need and then some.  As we all know launch monitors can be very misleading.  However, it seems like the more I read about the titleist monitor the more I think you can actually trust those numbers.

[LongWay]

What Shawn said is 100% correct, regardless of clubhead speed optimal launch and spin are the key and is what it takes to win events

Clubhead speed is a factor in distance yes, however longdrive is not a clubhead speed contest

Carson

[TheDoctor]

The last post was in response to danny's post that mentioned Zuback goes over 160mph.  If his ball speed was 205 all week as measured by the titleist monitor, then his swing speed was probably closer to 138.  He clearly was hitting the best all week which would suggest a smash factor close to 1.50.  Lets remember that smash factors above 1.50 are possible and are the very reason why people who swing 130 can be very competitive.  I have recorded smashfacters of over 1.60 and that is the only reason I can compete at a very high level.

[Kenny]

Average top lder swings 142 to 148 max ...   160 swing speed is not happening.

I have results that show 142 with solid contact can get you 215 ball speed.

Kenny

[CirrusHead]

I remember Adam Stacey getting sweet contact for 141/215 in '05 (1.52 smash factor)
Gerry James went 128/194 to win in '05 (1.52 smash factor)

Zuback is quoted in many sources as having done 163.  Fister says he has done 171.  But the thing is, in neither case does it mention that they did that while hitting a ball in a comp.  Zuback's was "measured by laser"; Fister himself said he went to a lab in 95 or 96, where they fitted his club with a bunch of sensors, and he just swung, swung, and swung.
http://www.incepta.ca/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=1718&highlight=
http://www.incepta.ca/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=1564&start=0
In that thread, Fister talks a bit about these.  In '05 he said he could reach 150 a couple times.  Swinging for speed and swinging while hitting a ball are two different things.
I doubt Zuback can do 163 anymore (who knows what club he was using), but if given some air swings, he could certainly pass 150.  I read that in PDC 2003, he hit his best drive at 155 mph swing...with a measly 193 mph ball speed for 358 yards.  Also heard that Joe Miller surpassed 160 as measured during 2005 in earlier rounds.  I saw in a video ("competitors driving a golf ball over 400 feet") Zuback undergoing lab testing.  A close look showed speeds and angles, and the numbers that I presumed were swing speed were 136-138 on average, with a few over 140.  Zuback CAN swing over 150- but he DOESN'T.
I bet a good share of the competitors are capable of swinging above 150- but they are NOT doing 150 in competition.  Hitting the ball flush and straight with high angle and low spin at 140 is better than topping or slicing it at 150, and competitors know that.  Swing speed is a way toward hitting farther, but it can only help so much.
Does 150 happen in competition?  I disagree that it doesn't.  Gureckis got 153 mph on his last swing in '05 finals, with measly contact (205 mph)- he got 148/212.  Burger reportedly won 03 with a 159.  It happens, but don't count on it.

The bottom line is, people are capable of swinging 150+ but do not do so in competition, because the hitting is what counts.

By the way, the Beltronics Swingmate goes a few mph fast.

[Troskie]

trying to swing that fast will throw my back out

i'll stick to the high 130's w/ good contact and good ball placement to make sure I advance, after all, didn't Mobley win w/ this concept in mind?

people are hung up on this CHS crap, i don't care if you swing 150 and hit it flush, if you don't hit it w/ the right launch angle and spin on the right part of the grid, you still won't win. Long drive is so much more than ball speed, club head speed, and large juevo's

[TheDoctor]

Cirrushead,  a bet on the fact that "a good share of the competiters can swing 150" is a losing wager.

[Kenny]

150 + back in 02 or 03 when there was longer shaft lenght or unlimited lenght ... maybe ...

Now ?  Doubt it

Listen .. I have tested the best in the World this year at 6 events.   150 has not happened ....  Period ..

Kenny

[bubbamaker]

Kenny, which type of launch monitor do you use to test these guys?  I'm just curious.

Thanks,

Brett

P.S.  This is an interesting discussion.

[Kenny]

Zelicity launch monitor ...  This unit and the laptop cost just over $5,000.00

[Kenny]

Hmm his post was deleted

[Charles-K]

...

[Charles-K]

Listen .. I have tested the best in the World this year at 6 events.   150 has not happened ....  Period ..

Kenny

I left out some of the top 24 so I reposted...
Just interested: Below is a list of the 'Best in the World' for 2006. Which of these did you test and what numbers did you record?

1.   Jason Zuback: Cobra head w/ Graphite Design shaft
2.   Eric Lastowka: Cobra head w/ Accuflex shaft
3.   Patrick Hopper: Bang head w/ Bang shaft
4.   Danny Luirette: Alpha head w/ Accuflex shaft
5.   Baden Waiwai: Cobra head w/ Penley shaft
6.   Allen McDougall: Krank head w/ Harrison shaft
7.   Derek Hines: Cobra head w/ Graphite Design shaft
8.   Mike Dobbyn: Geek head w/ Accuflex shaft
9.   Jamie Sadlowski - St. Paul, Alberta, Canada
10.   Brent Kearney - Queensland, Australia
11.   Patrick Bistrian - Amagansett, NY
12.   Kevin Bullard - Cedartown, GA
13.   Dustin Merrill - St. Louis, MO
14.   C.J. Smith - Belleville, IL
15.   Davyn Nola - Auckland, New Zealand
16.   Zac Adams
17.   Tom Roskos
18.   Adam Stacey
19.   Jason Chester
20.   Brian Nash
21.   Robbie Biershank
22.   Justin James
23.   Carl Wolter
24.   David Mobley

[bubbamaker]

Thanks Kenny.

[gringo]

I can tell that winter is coming.  WHO CARES!!!!!!!!!!!  It is all a bunch of fish tales anyway.